Calebs Airplane

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Posts by Calebs Airplane

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  29

  New Arrangement: All Can Listen In to Bethel Annual Meeting

  by Red Piller in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a letter read at our meeting.. .

  our congregation is assigned a location (a nearby congregation) to listen (video, also?

  ) to the annual meeting.

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  Calebs Airplane

  
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  33

  My doubting friend came by and left the letter...

  by confusedandalone in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i hope that i am not eating up alot of bandwidth and annoying anyone.

  however as i make my exit i want to reveal as many things as possible.

  i have a friend who had doubts about the latest change and wrote a letter.

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  Calebs Airplane

  "First, you ask why Jehovah revealed the greater fulfillment of the prophecy in Daniel 4:10-17 about the "seven times" that would end in 1914 to Brother Russell if he was not part of "the faithful and discreet slave." (Matthew 24:45-47)

  If God revealed it to anyone (which he obviously did not), then "He" must have revealed it to John Aquila Brown in 1823 (not Russell in 1873)...
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  17

  Scandalous injustice at JC - read this!

  by hamsterbait in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  http://web.archive.org/web/20011228232206/http://homepages.tesco.net/~a17/stooges.htm.

  i am in the process and cannot belive the ignorance and deceit these "ministers for justice" used!.

  hb.

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  Calebs Airplane

  Way too long to read without strong coffee...

  
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  17

  How Many JWs Are Confident They Are Worthy?

  by Ding in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  which jws do you think actually feel confident that they would survive armageddon if it came tomorrow?

  gb members?

  bethelites?

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  Calebs Airplane

  Most JWs are on an emotional roller-coaster... they're just holding on for dear life and hoping for the best.

  
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  37

  Excuse needed to get out of talk

  by noonehome in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i work with the school overseer so he'll be with me all day before the meeting...so being 'sick' isn't an option.

  this really isn't like me to weasel my way out of something....but i've been ridiculously depressed lately and honestly i just don't have it in me to do anything let alone put a talk together.

  everytime i do one it takes allot out of me and let's just say the well is pretty dry.

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  Calebs Airplane

  Tell them your dog ate your part and show them proof...
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  9

  Jesus, the Money-Changers and ATM machines ?

  by RubaDub in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  everytime i go to an assembly, a picture with the atm machine comes to mind.. in one of the older publications there was a picture of jesus in the temple over-turning the tables of the money-changers.. come on photoshop people .... add a couple of atm machines falling down into the picture.. it would be great to have for a party and the time spent could be added to your monthly service time.. rub a dub.

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  Calebs Airplane

  From Ministry Today magazine.. Direct Donations

  Written by Cameron Fisher

  When a Georgia pastor created a ‘tithing ATM’ for his church, giving increased—as did the ethical questions.

  ---

  Paying your tithes may never be the same again. Although churches have long accepted credit and debit cards as part of the tithing process, one pastor is pioneering a new way of supporting the storehouse beyond the traditional offering plate.

  In 2005, Marty Baker, lead pastor of Stevens Creek Church in Augusta, Ga., created the Secure Give system for his local church. Based around an ATM-like machine called a "giving kiosk," Secure Give allows users to give tithes, offerings or other donations with a single swipe of a credit or debit card. Each kiosk can be freestanding, complete with a black pedestal topped with a computer touch screen, numeric keypad and magnetic-strip reader, or it can be a tabletop unit. When a user completes a "transaction," data is immediately sent to a church's central computer system and the donor can receive both an e-mail confirmation and a printed receipt.

  The idea for the system was birthed when a churchgoer approached Baker during a building drive. The man wanted to use his debit card to donate money rather than write a check. That prompted Baker to notice how fewer people—especially from the younger generation—were carrying cash in their wallets. He then delved into studying the electronic payment business. With the help of a computer programmer who attends Stevens Creek, Baker designed his machine and an ATM company built the prototype to place in the Stevens Creek lobby.

  Three years later, Baker, along with his wife, Patty, have introduced Secure Give to more than 30 churches, hospital foundations, universities, museums, ballet theatres and other organizations. Their products can be found in church lobbies of all denominations and locations, from Rochester, N.Y., to San Jose, Calif., to Pearl Harbor, Hawaii.

  "People in general have been very receptive to the kiosks," Baker says. "Some were a little intimidated at first, but the system is very user-friendly. They are excited to have different options in which they can donate to their church."

  If It Works at Home ...

  The 1,100-member Stevens Creek uses three giving kiosks, though the church certainly hasn't discontinued "traditional" giving. Many of those who use the system place their receipts in the regular offering basket.

  "The Bible talks about bringing your offerings to the church, and [Stevens Creek attendees] like the feeling of dropping their offering in the plate," Patty Baker adds. "We also believe that your offering is part of worship, so that's how they participate."

  Worshipers from other churches apparently feel the same. In Hilton Head, S.C., Central Church installed a giving kiosk a year ago and has heard nary a complaint.

  "We bought it to see how it would work in our church," says administrative pastor Aaron Thielemier. "So many of our attendees are on the edge of technology, and like most of the younger generation, they simply don't carry cash. But just because they don't carry cash doesn't mean they don't have a heart for giving. [The kiosk] keeps the concept of giving in front of them, and it is always available. ... My grandmother asks, 'Why do you have an ATM in your lobby?' But that's a good thing. It's a great icebreaker and if they need assistance, we're here to give it."

  Of course, the kiosk idea isn't always an instant hit. "It's been a challenge to get people to use it," says Troy McCoy, administrative pastor at Calvary Christian Center in Ormond Beach, Fla. "Before we acquired [the Secure Give system] we had tithe envelopes with space to write your credit card number, so we are trying to change that mentality."

  For those still uneasy about swiping a card for their tithe, their reluctance at using the system is understandable. This is, after all, about more than just installing an ATM in a church lobby. For starters, there is the obvious case of good motives meeting bad execution. A churchgoer who's unwise with money, for example, now has the opportunity to grow deeper in debt by tithing with a credit card.

  Baker factored this in, which is why the Secure Give system can be set up for churches that use debit cards only. In fact, that's often to a church's advantage. If a church chooses to be debit only, the transaction fees are minimal. On the other hand, if a congregation accepts credit cards, a 2 to 3 percent fee (on average) is discounted from the contribution.

  "When a contributor donates $1,000 with a credit card," Baker offers as an example, "it costs the church around $20 to process the gift. When a contributor donates $1,000 with a debit card using his PIN number, it costs the church 75 cents." He points out that most churches offer some sort of financial management class, and "if the people are taught about biblical finances, then using a credit card for gas, groceries—or giving—is not a problem."

  It's also less of a dilemma than some may think for the churches open to electronic giving. "This may make some people cringe," Baker says, "but in reality electronic gifts do not require as much administrative work on the local church. There is a portion of every tithe dollar that goes to administration, whether it is collected by traditional means or from a giving kiosk. As a pastor, I want to keep as much money as possible in ministry."

  So far, he seems to have succeeded within his own church. Last year, Stevens Creek took in more than $200,000 through the kiosks. It expects that to increase this year to at least $250,000. In February of this year, another church using the Secure Give system received $2,500 by using one kiosk. The following month it added two more and giving jumped to $16,500 through the kiosks alone.

  Safe, Sound and Heaven-bent

  Besides potentially affecting giving, Secure Give also adds a level of security. Stevens Creek experienced this firsthand in November 2005.

  "The collection from a Sunday's offering was deposited at the local bank on Monday," Baker recalls. "Tuesday the local branch transferred the deposit to their home office via a courier. The courier was robbed. Our office staff had to call 116 families and ask them to stop payment on their check and to close their bank account. It was announced that day, 'If you donated at the giving kiosk, your gifts were secure.'"

  In addition, many prefer the perks that come along with using the cards. "Some use their American Express to get SkyMiles," says Terry Taylor, whose Family Church of West Monroe, La., has had a kiosk for nearly two years. "Convenience is the main thing, and there just aren't many disadvantages. If I had to think of a negative, I guess it would be that perhaps there is that lost moment when couples would pray over their offering as they placed it in the offering."

  Fundamentalists would add that there is a deeper moral dilemma of contributing to the diluting of a sacred act of worship. It's bad enough some churches accept credit cards, they argue. Baker is quick to point out, however, that there is a difference between using credit cards to purchase products at a church's bookstore and to make a tithe or offering.

  "Secure Give focuses on donations and not products," he says. "A person would receive a product from their swipe of the card at the bookstore. When they swipe a card at the kiosk, they are laying up treasures in heaven."

  Baker, an ordained bishop in the Church of God (Cleveland, Tenn.), acknowledges the doubters. But he also believes the church's culture will see a dramatic shift as more cards begin to replace cash. The next few years, he says, "could be comparable to another upheaval centuries ago, when offerings of grain and animals were replaced with what was then the newfangled medium of money. ... I'll bet that caused a stir too."

  

  
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  35

  How would YOU explain cognitive disonance to a Jehovahs Witness on your doorstep

  by smiddy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  seriously , in plain simple language that the most thick headed jw would understand.. and what examples would you use.. smiddy.

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  Calebs Airplane

  It is NOT possible to explain this on your door step... While you attempt to explain this, the JW will wondering what subject he needs to look up in his Reasoning book to refute whatever it is he thinks you're saying... This will end with the JW saying something like: "If you wish, I can research this matter further and return next week with a Biblical answer to that question".... Of course, 9 times out of 10, he'll forget this conversation even happened and will probably never return.
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  32

  Revelation Climax book - what are the most ridiculous claims in it?

  by RayPublisher in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i got to thinking about all the strange interpretations in the old revelation climax book now that i have perused it again on pdf.

  (thanks atlantis!).

  does anyone care to toss in their two cents on what are the most outrageous and/or ridiculous claims in it?.

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  Calebs Airplane

  Box

  on page 32...

  ATime for Testing and Judging

  Jesus was baptized and anointed as King-Designate at the Jordan River about October 29 C.E. Three and a half years later, in 33 C.E., he came to Jerusalem’s temple and threw out those who were making it a cave of robbers. There appears to be a parallel to this in the three-and-a-half-year period from Jesus’ enthronement in the heavens in October 1914 until his coming to inspect professed Christians as judgment began with the house of God. (Matthew 21:12, 13; 1 Peter 4:17) Early in 1918 the Kingdom activity of Jehovah’s people met with great opposition. It was a time of testing earth wide, and fearful ones were sifted out. In May 1918 Christendom’s clergy instigated the imprisonment of officials of the Watch Tower Society, but nine months later these were released. Later, the false charges against them were dropped. From 1919 the organization of God’s people, tried and refined, moved zealously forward to proclaim Jehovah’s Kingdom by Christ Jesus as the hope for mankind.—Malachi 3:1-3.

  As Jesus began his inspection in 1918, the clergy of Christendom no doubt received an adverse judgment. Not only had they raised up persecution against God’s people but they had also incurred heavy bloodguilt by supporting the contending nations during the first world war. (Revelation 18:21, 24) Those clergymen then placed their hope in the man-made League of Nations. Along with the entire world empire of false religion, Christendom had fallen completely from God’s favor by 1919.

  W TF ? A THREE-AND-A-HALF-YEAR period???
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  7

  2014 Memorial Talk Outline & 2014 Special Talk Outline

  by Calebs Airplane in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  these usually come out about this time of the year... does anyone have these yet?.

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  Calebs Airplane

  Atlantis... any idea on why these outlines are delayed this year?
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  3

  Monica Jaramillo sex abuse case

  by joe134cd in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  when i first became aware of the sex abuse cases about 12 months ago.

  i thought they could perhaps be isolated cases.

  now i'm just wondering how big this thing is going to get.

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  Calebs Airplane

  You can't be DF'd for talking about current events...